Wednesday, October 1, 2008

Hope for our Country

To add onto yesterday's post.....

There have been so many emails sent out 'warning' us of God's wrath if we make idols of other things besides God. A lot of threats from our christian leaders as to what will happen if we "kick God out" of our country and hearts. They warn us that God will be angry and turn His back on us.

I disagree.

I agree that a nation that doesn't put God first is in trouble... but not because God will me 'mad' at them and His wrath will pour out like the Old Testament stories. I really believe Jesus changed that. I really do not believe that God punishes us like that.

BUT I do believe that these warnings are correct. That sins DO have consequences and any nation that doesn't put God first.... that is full of idols.... IS in trouble. This goes back to PK's American Idols series so much!

Very clearly as a nation, we are headed down the same path every other nation that turned from God, did. We are looking for anything to fill that spot that is designed in us that only God, our Creator can fill. We are looking for significance & value that only He can give. We turn to pleasure, power, money, the list goes on and on. What has happened on Wall Street is a prime example. Greed got us here. The love & abuse of money. Money in itself is neither bad nor good --- but when it is put above God in our lives.... it becomes destructive. Money takes on the morality of whoever has it. It can be used for a lot of bad or a lot of good.

My point in all this gibberish is to say that God loves us. He wants good for us, but He's a just God and a jealous God. He won't 'punish' us. Jesus changed that for us.... but our sins do have consequences. Our idols do give satan a foothold in our lives. Satan destroys, distorts and ruins everything he touches. People & countries alike.

Pray for our leaders. Pray for our government. Pray for our own hearts - that we won't be afraid of God or His wrath --- but that we will be afraid of sin and its consequences!!!

Keep God first! "Seek first His kingdom and righteousness...."Him first!! (Matthew 6:33)

More on this tomorrow!!!.............


Anonymous said...

A quick reading of John's Revelation shows that God will still bring wrath upon man kind. Following Jesus' death in AD 70, God used the Romans to destroy Israel as a nation state until 1948. Much like he used the Babylonians and Assyrians during the time of the exile for Israel and Judah. A reading of Romans 12:19 shows that God also isn't through getting his vengence. His death on the cross made it so that those who would believe would not have to endure his wrath. He is our propitiation as 2 Corinithians 5 tells us. Praise be to Him and Him alone for his grace that spears us from his coming judgement.

Just a thought.

Randi Jo :) said...

Thanks Allen! I was hoping you'd comment because I have so many questions still on this topic and could use all the resources out there!

Revelation talks about end times though doesn't it? Is that what you were referring to? About God's wrath through eternal judgement? It discusses when we will be judged on if we accepted Jesus or not. but it isn't about God's wrath for sins is it?

Sin isn't an issue that God has to punish us for anymore right? Sin has natural consequences the way the world/ morality was created - but it's not 'punishment' per say.

I get what you're saying.... just have so many questions. so I'll sort of play advocate and bounce some more ideas off you. I don't know the proper context of these verses so I'm going to have to look further.

I don't believe God has wrath / 'punishment' here for sins solely because of what Jesus did. But I guess for people who don't know Jesus -- God does still pour out His wrath, maybe?? because those people aren't saved - don't have the connection to God thruogh Jesus.

and if God does have wrath for those who don't know Jesus --- does he judge us corporately as a body and punish/ have wrath corporately (like say - a nation - if the majority didn't accept Jesus)???

or are people who are suffering (being punished) just suffering because the consequences of having idols/ not putting God first / not accepting Jesus --- not punishment or his wrath --- but because they don't put God first so therefore the devil has power and so his fruits are showing in their lives. he destroys, distorts and ruins everything.

I am not fearful of God's wrath....because of Jesus... and I know I am freed of guilt & condemnation because of Him.

but what about being part of a corporate body that doesn't recognize Jesus or accept Him anymore as a whole --- i'm not sure if I should be concerned about God's wrath or not.

but didn't Jesus coming taking on ALL the sins of the world. whether we accepted waht He did or not ---- doesn't cahnge that He did it for ALL. we don't have to be 'punished' for sin --- we just have to answer if we accepted or rejected Jesus.

PHEW! I'm exhausted now hehehe

thanks for whatever scripture/ thoughts you have to offer.

ultimately --- my point is - there is hope! Jesus came so we are free from condemnation, blame, shame, punishment. God can make good out of anything and I truly believe that He is good and wants good for us and that although our sins detours us from His blessings --- I don't believe He punishes us.

what do you believe about Luke 2:13 - 14 ---- "on earth, peace, good will toward men" is this not talking about the fact that there was now peace betweeen man & God.

that we could be restored to Him. no longer to have to endure His wrath and anger for our failures.

hopefully I made some sense here!

Jesus didn't take on all the sins of this world so we would have to endure punishment again for those same sins, right? or is this "double jeopardy" true? what He did wasn't enough?

Randi Jo :) said...

p.s. the more I thought about it -- the more I thought..... well it doesn't matter WHY they come - but consequences do come because of our sin.

whether it be 'wrath' or 'natural consequences' ---- there are consequences for sin and not putting God first. for not accepting Jesus. for not being obedient. Jesus saved us from eternal consequence --- but there are consequences here. when we sin (put other things above God) we leave room for the devil --- and the devil destroys, distorts and ruins anything its in.

:) but there's hope! God loves us!! Loves us so much that He sent His only son so we could be restored to Him and be righteous in God's eyes because Jesus took on our sin, we took on His righteousness!! Jesus came!!!!!! there's hope! :) we are restored back to God.

babyfordawn1983 said...

I have to say that this blog was a little advanced for me and I don't quite understand everything that you have written but I will understand with time. I do believe, however, that our nation is fastly turning its back on Him and that is just heart breaking for me. There is way too much worry about fianances and laws that the most important things are being overlooked. No, I take that back. They aren't being overlooked, He is being ignored. And ignorance towards Him can only cause trouble. I know that all of us are ignorant in ways towards Him but once you turn your back on Him it becomes very hard to find your way back. I know because I am learning that lesson now.

Randi Jo :) said...

Thanks as always Dawn. To tell you the truth --- this blog entry was a little over my head too! ultimately a lot of this is just details --- and are totally secondary to the major points of God's teaching. just details. I just wanted to sort of throw it all out there and see what stuck hahaha clearly I just have a lot of questions too --- but I'm learning and looking up answers, reading the Bible, asking God and I know He will help comfort my concerns & questions.

Thanks for your input as always. :)

Randi Jo :) said...

p.s. I hope this post shows how okay it is to not know the answers. I don't know the answers!! and it's okay! :)

I used to get so discouraged when I found anything that was grey & that I couldn't nail down to a concrete for sure answer --- but I realized that's what faith is all about. like walking in fog - you can see what's ahead - sometimes you can make it out clearer than others --- but our job is just to not give up. to keep going forward. to use our defogger (word of God, prayer) to get things to be clearer :) love ya!

Randi Jo :) said...

@ Allen -- about romans 12:19 --- are we sure it's not talking about eternal wrath? eternal judgement/damnation.

Anonymous said...

Gibberish--not on your life! Some hard questions and lots to wrestle with but valuable insight too!

Monday through Sunday said...

excellent post..excellent

You inspire me to dig in deeper. Thank you!